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[Robert Champion]

I know I am going to get shit for this but here it goes.

You know how you go to the amusement park and there is that one super intense roller coaster that some people are just too scared to ride?  You know what I am talking about.  Going to see Umphrey's these days is like going to the amusement park and making a dash to that one roller coaster...getting on it....and riding it 14 times then leaving without riding any other rides.  It's intense as hell but after about the fifth or sixth time it starts to lose something because you begin to know exactly what is around the corner for that one day at the park.

I want to ride all the rides in the amusement park and I know that Umphrey's McGee is the ticket taker to all of them because I have ecstatically listened to all of their albums over the years.  We all know they go balls to the wall and we love it...I fucking love it.  But can't a guy just sit down and watch It's a small world after all for a few minutes and then get jacked up again?

The level of intensity at shows now is at such a level that I am begging for more of an ebb and flow with the live show.  What will the future hold for Umphrey's McGee?  I am eagerly watching how the next few years pan out for this band as they ride what we can all agree is the peak of their careers.  Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?  Will anyone actually take anyone seriously if Phish and UM are ever compared against each other in a conversation?  I think the answer is no but my point is that I am itching for the transition into a more mature sound when the partying and excelled lifestyle that the road offers with a youthful band makes way for the reflective lyrics and music of this great band.  I am sure it will happen at some point like it usually does when players get older. 

The lyrics of Umphrey's Mcgee can be powerful and thought provoking on a level that is not often found with bands in this circuit.  It's a delicate balance and at times these lyrics almost take a back seat at shows because the precise technicality of the instrumentation is usually at the forefront.  It's one of the great things about this band to be able to stand back in amazement at the execution of the transitions as the band performs live on stage.  I can only see longevity and stability in the work of this band and wish them health and happiness along the way as they get into the ser ser years of adulthood like I am living right now...I am also pumped to see these guys get older and how this will translate into their songwriting as their physical endurance with their hands start to naturally deteriorate.  Let's hope they stay healthy and have all of this in mind so we can be promised a nice long career from Chicago's finest progressive outfit.

That being said I had so much fun at The Canopy Club on Sunday.  I met some new and interesting people and my wife was able to reconnect with our maid of honor who lives down that way and teaches chorus for a local high school.  They are both huge umphreaks.  I also was able to tell Joel a joke outside the club and he seemed to get a kick out of it.

Knock Knock

Who's there?

Umphrey's McGee

Umphrey's McGee who?

Fuck Umphrey's McGee....I'm going to a Phish show.

He was either going to punch me in the face or laugh.  He laughed like I assumed he would.  I told him to get out there and kill it and he certainly earned his keep up on stage Sunday night.

I also told another completely not serious joke to the crowd waiting outside...Some of them were offended but what would I have been doing out front grovelling for extras if I wasn't a fan myself?  Here is how it goes...

Question -How many members of Umphrey's crew does it take to screw in a light bulb?
Answer - Fuck that...If I want to see a light show I will buy a Phish ticket.

The absurdity of all of this is the comparing of bands.  My advice to you kids who do this day in and day out on message boards and social networking sites.  The minute you start comparing bands of this caliber is the minute these bands start laughing at you and not with you...Surrender to the flow.

Keep a light heart ladies and gentlemen.  This band is putting on quite the fucking show these days.

Here is my rant earlier today.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/20604994

Rage...Rest...Repeat.

[Puddy40]

It's intense as hell but after about the fifth or sixth time it starts to lose something because you begin to know exactly what is around the corner for that one day at the park.

while this can be true, I definitely don't agree.  After seeing so many shows, we may know things like when the song will be finished, if this song will have an extended jam, etc etc, but I will say that even after my 75th show on Sunday, I can still be completely surprised once or twice a show.   Combine that with the improv, and that is why we keep coming back for more.

To use your analogy, that's like taking the same rollercoaster, but re doing the track every time.  Adding a loop here, or an unexpected turn there.

[rebub.]

 

[Robert Champion]

Puddy40 - I am sure you are a huge fan and this thread is not to take away from that in any way.  I have been going to see Umphrey's McGee for a long time now.  My first show was at The Elbo Room right here in Chicago.  I think I paid 6 dollars for that ticket.  I have been observing their career closely ever since the first time I caught a glimpse of what they did on stage.  That being said...I have not seen Umphrey's McGee 75 times but I do see them whenever I get the chance.  I'm sure you have a great time at shows and the intent of this thread is to not take away from that.

Moreover, I should probably make it pretty clear that I prefer Umphrey's studio albums over their actual live show.  I know that isn't a popular thing to say on here but it's true for me and I stand by it as far as a personal preference is concerned.

[buddhaa]

It's intense as hell but after about the fifth or sixth time it starts to lose something because you begin to know exactly what is around the corner for that one day at the park.

while this can be true, I definitely don't agree.  After seeing so many shows, we may know things like when the song will be finished, if this song will have an extended jam, etc etc, but I will say that even after my 75th show on Sunday, I can still be completely surprised once or twice a show.   Combine that with the improv, and that is why we keep coming back for more.

To use your analogy, that's like taking the same rollercoaster, but re doing the track every time.  Adding a loop here, or an unexpected turn there.

I would disagree with the bold and agree with the underlined.  I would say that the first analogy fits waaaaay more with Phish 3.0. There are no jams on any song and you know exactly what you are going to get, well played concise songs and 10+ songs a set. (not trying to make this a whole um vs phish thing but the analogy is off.) They used to me more like analogy #2 like UM is in now back in the 1994ish era where you really never knew where things were going and their jams were varied (and the actually had jams in many of the songs).  Right now you never have any idea where UM is going to take the next jam, it might be funky, reggae, metal, dancey, jazzy, ect.  Saying after you have been on the coaster 6 or 7 times and know whats coming couldnt be farther from the truth when talking about UM.  After riding so many times you do know the second they drop the song and go into a stew, but NOT A CLUE where that stew will go.

And does you liking the studio more than the live UM mean you prefer studio phish to live phish? and if not, why?

[JWelsh]

Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?

Sure hope not.

[buddhaa]

Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?

Sure hope not.

[PKSConrad]

Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?

Sure hope not.

+1

[3x40oz]

Reluctant response, since I never know if Bobby the Champ is trolling or not...

I don't want UM to play 15-song sets chock full of ballads, truncated jams, and piss-break songs. The "precise technicality of the instrumentation" and the creativity and nightly improvisation is what sets this band apart, for me personally. I enjoy their studio albums, and I listen to their studio albums at home, but if I went to a show these days and saw a 4 minute Miami Virtue or a standardtown In the Kitchen, I'd be pretty bummed out. UM's lyrics are just OK to me. Except for All Things Ninja; those lyrics get me every time.

Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?

Sure hope not.

[wizardburialwalk]

I'm sure if they start wearing down, they'll just tour less. Just like your favorite band Phish does

[LarrySellers]

Will UM ever put out an album like Joy?

Sure hope not.

+1

[Robert Champion]

buddhaa - I am not going to get into a conversation that involves comparing and contrasting Phish to UM.  If you go back and read my original post I think that getting into conversations like that is not only short sided but is also extremely disrespectful to both bands.  I don't do it and I don't recommend it if you want to be taken seriously when talking about this circuit.  That is just my opinion on it.

JWelsh - Something tells me you get my jist.

3x40oz - What a piss break song to you is not what a piss break song is to someone else.  For instance, the longest line in the men's bathroom on Sunday was during "Day Nurse" and that was when almost everyone in the room at least had some idea of what was about to happen for at least a portion of that set.  Was that a piss break moment?  Not for many but on Sunday the line to the bathroom was longer than the actual intermission.  Then again, I don't schedule my pissing around any song.  If I have to piss then I go take a piss.  Bands don't determine that for me.  I do.

[jim]

Puddy40 - I am sure you are a huge fan and this thread is not to take away from that in any way.  I have been going to see Umphrey's McGee for a long time now.  My first show was at The Elbo Room right here in Chicago.  I think I paid 6 dollars for that ticket.  I have been observing their career closely ever since the first time I caught a glimpse of what they did on stage.  That being said...I have not seen Umphrey's McGee 75 times but I do see them whenever I get the chance.  I'm sure you have a great time at shows and the intent of this thread is to not take away from that.

Moreover, I should probably make it pretty clear that I prefer Umphrey's studio albums over their actual live show.  I know that isn't a popular thing to say on here but it's true for me and I stand by it as far as a personal preference is concerned.

yes--as much as I could listen to Anchor Drops any day of the week, I'd say you're on your own there.

[Robert Champion]

Jim - I think the musician and producer in me appreciates the studio work a lot because it has it's own life separate from the improvised versions that you get at a live show.  This isn't to say I don't like seeing these songs performed on stage.  I just get real enjoyment being able to listen to the produced work and listening to how certain songs take on a clear and concise meaning both lyrically and instrumentally on an album version.  I think this marriage gets lost a lot during the live show.

Let's make it clear that me saying I prefer the studio material does not mean I don't like the live versions.  It would be easy to make that assumption I suppose.

[3x40oz]

3x40oz - What a piss break song to you is not what a piss break song is to someone else.  For instance, the longest line in the men's bathroom on Sunday was during "Day Nurse" and that was when almost everyone in the room at least had some idea of what was about to happen for at least a portion of that set.  Was that a piss break moment?  Not for many but on Sunday the line to the bathroom was longer than the actual intermission.  Then again, I don't schedule my pissing around any song.  If I have to piss then I go take a piss.  Bands don't determine that for me.  I do.

Yes, of course, to each his own with regards to what constitutes a "piss break song." I don't really understand your argument on Day Nurse, because it has no lyrics, and, to the best of my knowledge, they have never opened that song up. So, some who have seen it live several times might consider it a piss break song since there is no chance a greatly diminished chance of improv. Personally, I love that song. I also agree with the portion of your statement that I bolded. This past fall at the 9:30 Club, I ran to the bathroom and the bar right before Bayliss's solo in August because I had to piss and wanted another beer. I did both and was back with my friends in about two minutes. Much easier than trying to piss during a popular piss song such as Hourglass. Or Joy, for that matter. 

[wizardburialwalk]

buddhaa - I am not going to get into a conversation that involves comparing and contrasting Phish to UM.  If you go back and read my original post I think that getting into conversations like that is not only short sided but is also extremely disrespectful to both bands.  I don't do it and I don't recommend it if you want to be taken seriously when talking about this circuit.  That is just my opinion on it.

JWelsh - Something tells me you get my jist.

3x40oz - What a piss break song to you is not what a piss break song is to someone else.  For instance, the longest line in the men's bathroom on Sunday was during "Day Nurse" and that was when almost everyone in the room at least had some idea of what was about to happen for at least a portion of that set.  Was that a piss break moment?  Not for many but on Sunday the line to the bathroom was longer than the actual intermission.  Then again, I don't schedule my pissing around any song.  If I have to piss then I go take a piss.  Bands don't determine that for me.  I do.

Did you have a camera set up out there or something to document this 'longest line of the night', or were you just out in the lobby the whole time? Because as far as I could tell, the lines to the pisser at Canopy were ever present, not just during Day Nurse. I'm sure the people pissing had to piss, just like you.

[Robert Champion]

3x40oz - The example I made was not an analysis on the song "Day Nurse."  To clarify, I was speaking of the fact that an almost sure fire Divisions was in the works to open up the second set and they were about to start digging into the idea of it all for that evening.  However, the line to the bathroom was looooooooong.

For me personally if a "Divisions" starts then I am probably going to stay planted to see how it pans out unless something strikes me differently like if I need to piss really bad or if some other more important thing comes up like an emergency or anything else that is higher on the pecking order than seeing a band at that moment.  If nothing else is getting in the way of my enjoyment of that song and everything is clicking along correctly then, for me personally, I am going to stand there and watch the whole thing pan out even if it takes an entire set to do so.  For some people not so much.  That being said I was in line to urinate during that portion of the set because pissing was more important at that moment.  Moreover, I don't stand with a bladder full of piss just to make it through any song at my age.  Being comfortable and seeing music is more important to me than being uncomfortable and seeing music no matter what band is playing that night.

This whole piss break argument has always made me laugh in confusion.  If you have to go piss then go and do it.  That really isn't what I was trying to get at with my initial post though.  The idea that we might miss out on some life changing version of a song because we have to take care of an important bodily function seems trivial to me at 35.  I didn't always feel this way so take it for what it is worth.  Mindsets change over time...Lord knows mine is not what is was back in the day when this was all new and fresh and new to me.

Jaded vet?  No way in hell....I love this band.

wizardburialwalk - I was out in that lobby for a very long time during the second set.  I posted up right by the door into the hall where the two rooms meet and had the whole second set to make observations.  It's not really what I was trying to get at with my initial post.  Just an observation.

[jessek]

RC,

I'm kind of confused by what you're trying to accomplish here... your message is unclear.  Or maybe I'm missing something.

You're an UM fan from way back... but you enjoy the albums and not live versions?  Which leads me to think that you dislike UM improvisation?  Do you like Umphrey's improvisation?

To me (and nearly every fan I know) the improv is really what makes this band so great.  I mean, I dig the compositions, and I dig the lyrics, but what's seriously special about UM is the improvisation... you just don't know where it's going to lead, you don't know what style or crazy mix of styles may occur, and you just don't always know where it might happen.  The variation of the live show is almost exclusively why I continue to come back.

So how can you say that a live show is like riding the same roller coaster over and over?  That statement just doesn't make any sense to me... can you try to explain that better?  I think you lost a lot of us with that statement.

Listening to the same album over and over is VERY similar to riding the same roller coaster over an over... that's a perfect analogy.  But the live shows?  I can't understand how you would feel that way... when that is where the unknown is most prevalent.

[buddhaa]

Jim - I think the musician and producer in me appreciates the studio work a lot because it has it's own life separate from the improvised versions that you get at a live show.  This isn't to say I don't like seeing these songs performed on stage.  I just get real enjoyment being able to listen to the produced work and listening to how certain songs take on a clear and concise meaning both lyrically and instrumentally on an album version.  I think this marriage gets lost a lot during the live show.

Let's make it clear that me saying I prefer the studio material does not mean I don't like the live versions. It would be easy to make that assumption I suppose.

Since you prefer the studio material over liver versions it implies that you like standard versions of songs and not like the amazing improv that seeing it live brings. (you might like it but you dont like it as much as very standard versions which are on studio's) And all their studio material is out there in the live performances so it doesnt make sense to make that statement unless you dont like the jamming or unless you dont think they sound like they do in the studio while playing live. if its the latter, id say their sound is always really good and their playing is almost at tight as their studio stuff

[Spamburgler]

"Knock Knock

Who's there?

Umphrey's McGee

Umphrey's McGee who?

Fuck Umphrey's McGee....I'm going to a Phish show."

I really don't know how this is a funny joke at all. I am not even trying to defend my favorite band here. Am I missing something? Is the punchline just that phish is better than UM?

[forget you know me]

buddhaa - I am not going to get into a conversation that involves comparing and contrasting Phish to UM.  If you go back and read my original post I think that getting into conversations like that is not only short sided but is also extremely disrespectful to both bands.  I don't do it and I don't recommend it if you want to be taken seriously when talking about this circuit.  That is just my opinion on it.

JWelsh - Something tells me you get my jist.

3x40oz - What a piss break song to you is not what a piss break song is to someone else.  For instance, the longest line in the men's bathroom on Sunday was during "Day Nurse" and that was when almost everyone in the room at least had some idea of what was about to happen for at least a portion of that set.  Was that a piss break moment?  Not for many but on Sunday the line to the bathroom was longer than the actual intermission.  Then again, I don't schedule my pissing around any song.  If I have to piss then I go take a piss.  Bands don't determine that for me.  I do.

Did you have a camera set up out there or something to document this 'longest line of the night', or were you just out in the lobby the whole time? Because as far as I could tell, the lines to the pisser at Canopy were ever present, not just during Day Nurse. I'm sure the people pissing had to piss, just like you.

i went piss at the time and it was pretty long.

this thread is confusing.

[shredsco]

"Knock Knock

Who's there?

Umphrey's McGee

Umphrey's McGee who?

Fuck Umphrey's McGee....I'm going to a Phish show."

I really don't know how this is a funny joke at all. I am not even trying to defend my favorite band here. Am I missing something? Is the punchline just that phish is better than UM?

This joke is not in the least bit funny. If OP is so concerned with not comparing the two bands, I am confused as to why you would tell a "joke" to one of the band members saying you like Phish better... I mean I think it's sarcastic, but from what I have deduced it sounds like OP likes Phish better, but I guess he'll say in a different way. So I don't really know what the joke even means... not to mention it's a knock knock.

Not really sure what you're trying to say but, "the thesis that you're writing is a piece of shit"

this thread is confusing.

[forget you know me]

OP had a couple of semi epic troll threads on the OG, so i cant tell if this is serious.

[Robert Champion]

I will go deeper into this because I want to have a legitimate conversation about it and what I am about to say is NOT me saying I do not like this band.  This is just my take on it as I am listening to it.  The improvisation that this band creates is actually extremely pedestrian and predictable as a musician listening to it as it happens and it does not thrill me the way their actual songs thrill me.  This is obviously the short answer and will probably not be sufficient for a lot of people and I understand that in saying what I just said a lot of people will shake their heads in confusion.  However, the metronome and training in my head is always at least three or four measures ahead of the music that is playing when Umphrey's is improvising on stage.  Fuck they are probably twelve or so measures ahead of me with due respect.  Again, this is not a slam it is just how my head works.  They are good at it and it is obviously working for them because they have been able to market these common cycles to an audience that lovingly accepts and embraces it.  Hell, I embrace and understand why it works and why it is a powerful tool to use in their setting and with their audience of fans.

At the end of the day as a musician I have to be honest with myself and with my experience making and listening to music and for me the improv, although very good and marketable to paying customers, is extremely basic and pedestrian and only really follows some basic fundementals of the tradition of improvisation as I know it.  It doesn't mean I hate it.  It just means for me their real strength lies in their talent to create the actual studio songs that turn into these improvisations that so many customers seem to love and that's fine with me.  I love that people love it.

Again, this is a short answer and the debate rages on I suppose.  I am uploading a new cloudcast that I produce to my website and it is rendering right now and have to get back to it becuase I have a deadline.  Does anyone like the music of the 70's?

...To be continued I suppose.

[kmdeadhead]

The improvisation that this band creates is actually extremely pedestrian and predictable as a musician listening to it as it happens and it does not thrill me the way their actual songs thrill me. 

At the end of the day as a musician I have to be honest with myself and with my experience making and listening to music and for me the improv, although very good and marketable to paying customers, is extremely basic and pedestrian and only really follows some basic fundementals of the tradition of improvisation as I know it.  It doesn't mean I hate it.  It just means for me their real strength lies in their talent to create the actual studio songs that turn into these improvisations that so many customers seem to love and that's fine with me.  I love that people love it.

I cannot disagree more.

As a musician myself I am constantly and have always been impressed with the level of UM's improv. IMO opinion they really are on a different level, their ability to build upon new chord progressions and bounce back between a few different ones, constantly building on them and making them tighter each time, is something that I think really separates them from the pack. I'd prefer tight and ever evolving improv than some aimless jamming.

And fwiw I go to music school and have shown a lot of different musicians UM and those who aren't impressed with the songs themselves (which is a about 2/5 people I've shown) are still extremely impressed with the improv. EVERYONE who I have shown UM to is shocked and amazed at the level of improvisation.